Country Unplugged: Chancey Williams

0:00He's a real life cowboy who traded the rodeo arena for the stage. But make no mistake, the cowboy part is still very much alive. This week on Country Unplugged, we're joined by singer-songwriter Chauncey Williams, whose journey from saddle bronc riding to Nashville is anything but your typical country music story. We're talking about the hard work it takes to build a career in country music, finding your own path in an industry full of twists and turns, and what it really means to play the Grand Ole Opry. Plus, there are stories about drinking with Toby Keith, the legendary Cheyenne Frontier Days, and even a few adventures in the movie business. So saddle up, because this is one country music journey you won't want to miss. This is Country Unplugged with Chauncey Williams. Country Unplugged would like to welcome... I feel like we've got a real life cowboy. That's right. Yeah. We do. We actually do have- Yeah ... a real life cowboy. Chauncey Williams is in the house. Hey, thanks for having me on. Thank you so much for coming in and having a chat with us. Yeah, this'll be fun.

1:01Um, w- there are so many things that I want to talk to you about because, because you really are you literally are a cowboy who sings country music songs. When I was growing up and I sort of started to get into country music, I thought that all country artists were basically cowboys who just happened to sing songs, and then they recorded them and put them out. Like, Willie Nelson was, like, riding around on a horse- Right ... and just happened to be singing songs. This is literally what you do. It is, yeah. And there, there's not a lot of, you know, unfortunately, there's not a lot of real cowboys that sing country music. It's kind of- No ... two different things. But seems like more and more nowadays there's getting to be more and more cowboys- Yeah ... that are singing. But yeah, that's... I grew up too thinking everybody that was singing with a cowboy hat was actually cowboys, but- Right ... turns out it's not necessarily true to the full extent. They're driving a Bronco rather than riding one- That's right. ... basically. Um, let's start at the very, very beginning. Okay. And your sort of childhood, where you grew up, and sort of how you ended up doing what you're doing, basically. Okay. Yeah, so I grew up on a ranch, uh, in the northeast corner of Wyoming. So

2:01Wyoming's the least populated state, you know, and it's, uh, but it's also like the seventh largest state by size. So I mean, there's nobody out there. But my folks ranch- Yeah ... in a small town called Moorcroft, Wyoming. So I grew up ranching. And from a young age we were riding horses. We were riding when we were four- Yeah ... by ourselves. And so grew up riding horses, grew up ranching, being a cowboy. So can I just interrupt you, though? Yeah. Um, because I am British- Okay ... in case you hadn't noticed the accent. Um, - Right ... when you say you grew up ranching- Yeah ... ranching. Ranching. What does that mean? Cattle? Yep. Okay. Good. Cattle- Just checking ... and sheep, and like, so you know, farmers, uh, raise crops- Yeah ... and ranchers raise livestock. Got it. So they count- Oh, that's the... Oh, so you- Yeah. I never knew that. And, and, and ranchers do a little farming and farmers do a little ranching. Okay. But in general, we consider ourself ranchers and not farmers. So you had c- like livestock, cattle- Yep ... sheep. We had cattle and sheep growing up, and still do. That's what we ranch today. And horses, you know, we work everything- Yeah ... horseback. And so grew up riding since we were little kids, and started rodeoing

3:06young, you know. Yeah. At youth rodeos, me and my brothers learned to rope and ride and do all the c- youth events growing up. So you know, we, we still ranch to this day, but you know, I went to junior high and high school rodeos was kind of my main thing, and- Yeah. So I made the high school national finals in the saddle bronc riding, which is bucking horses. Okay. Uh, when I- That's when you have to, like, hang on for like eight seconds, right? Yep. Yep. What is that? It's pretty wild. I've seen the videos. It's pretty wild. It's... looks pretty... There's a good chance that you're going to get seriously injured doing this, right? Yeah, it's, it's super dangerous for sure, you know. So, like, it's... You know, rodeo came from ranching things, right? Yeah. So like, uh, saddle bronc riding and bareback riding came from breaking horses on ranches. That's... And they made it a sport. You know, calf roping and steer wrestling was the same. Like, they would do that on ranches- Yeah ... having to catch steers and stuff. So we, you know, we rode saddle broncs, which is the, the bucking horse version with the saddle on them.

4:08Mm-hmm. And there's bareback riding, which my... We didn't do that, but that's with the rigging. It's, it's kind of hard to explain. They're a little bit different styles. Right. But I rode the saddle bronc version of rodeo. Okay. So did that, you know, all through high school and then I went on to college. Went to college on a rodeo scholarship, and, uh- That's a thing? Yep. Yeah, there's a l- there's a lot of colleges around- That's so cool ... around the US. Yeah, it's just like a, you know, a college sport, just like football or, you know, what volleyball would be. But it's just on a smaller scale. You know, not every school has a rodeo school. Right. Uh, so but you know, most of the states do. So and then went to college on a rodeo scholarship and rode saddle broncs and made the college national finals twice. Yeah. And so that's... The college national finals is all the schools throughout the nation. You know, uh, each region sends their top three guys to the national finals- Yeah ... and then you compete there. So yeah, and then so rodeo was always the main thing, you know. I was gonna rodeo

5:11forever, I thought, you know, and then got into music and headed me down this pathway. But how... That, that's a very generalized, sweeping statement there that you just brushed under the line. Right. "Ended up doing music." And now here we are in Nashville. Um, how... First off, did you ever get ser- did you ever get injured badly doing it? I was pretty fortunate. I've had a lot of friends get hurt pretty bad, but I got hurt once pretty bad at a college rodeo. A horse fell with me and then kicked me in the back of the head and-... you know, I was out for quite a while. Woke up in the hospital, but- Oh ... I think it all turned out all right. You guys still hear me? Okay, good. It's fine, apart from the hallucinations. I got a ba- I got a pretty big scar on the back of my head from it, but you know. I have friends that have been hurt a lot worse than that, you know. Yeah. You know, bucking horses seems to be... You get hurt way worse. Like, everybody thinks bull riding so, uh, is the most dangerous event, but it's not. Right. Like, like bucking horse riding is. You know, it, it can paralyze you'cause you're so high up- Yeah ... on those horses, and the way they buck and the way you, you get bucked off. If

6:14you get bucked off wrong, you know, your spine or- Yeah ... or head is-... is kind of out there in the open I mean, riding a horse in general is, I always think is,'cause I, I grew up riding. I did not grow up doing rodeo- Right ... that is for sure, but I had a little pony when I was a kid- Yeah ... and stuff like that. Horses in general, even broke horses, are, are, they're dangerous animals. I mean- It's a wi- it's an animal at the end of the day. Yep And it can just turn like that, and you, you have no idea how it squeaks it. And every animal, you know, we, we've had gentle horses over the years that just ha- had a day that- Yeah ... might buck you off or kick you or something. They would typically never do that, but like you said, they're- Yeah ... they're a wild animal, so- Right ... sometimes people take it for granted how, you know, s- anything can happen with a horse. E- even if they're super gentle and you're loping across the pasture and they trip on something- Yeah ... that could paralyze you. I mean, it's, it's... Horses are dangerous- Yeah ... but they're, they're the most wonderful animals in the world, too. Very dangerous, and you decided,"I'll do the most dangerous thing with them by-" Yeah ..."learning how to buck them." I think it's'cause my dad, you know, our dad rodeoed and, you know, he w- he won a lot when he was younger, and we just kinda wanted to follow in his footsteps. And so

7:17me and my brothers all rodeoed too because of that. Yeah. But it's, it was fun and, you know, I wouldn't trade it for anything. I loved every minute of it. Yeah. And it... But, you know, it's, competitive rodeo is, is a, a real young man's game. Like, you know, s- all those guys winning today are in their early to mid-20s. Yeah, there's not many 50-year-olds doing it, right? No, they're- I'm not saying that you're 50. No. But, uh but, you know. No, but, like, just, just your body reflexes and stuff and, you know, being healthy all the time. Yeah. The young guys are quicker, and they're more hungry for it. You know, once you do it for quite a few years, you, you know, you might have a, a sense of fear in there just a little bit- Yeah ... that might make you hesitate- Yeah ... when you should be making a move, but you're not, which makes the younger guys win more often. Right. Yeah. And so how did you end up doing music? Because did you start playing music at a young age, or? Yeah, so I played music, you know, growing up in high school. S- me and a couple buddies started a band in high school, but it was just a thing for fun, you know? I ne- I never thought I would do it as a career. And then we kept the band going

8:21through college, so, but, you know, again, college was my main thing and, and college rodeo was my focus'cause I was there on a scholarship, so. But had the band through college, and it was a lot of fun, and so I ended up going to college for seven years. I got a bachelor's degree in political science a- and a Master's degree in public administration. I read somewhere you've got four degrees. Yeah, and then I have- Oh, really? ... two associate's degrees too if you count those, so I do have four degrees. But I just, I was, I was really good at college. I, I, I really enjoyed college. Not the class part so much, but, you know, just, uh, being in college was a lot of fun. Mm-hmm. And at the time, my band was still going to college when I graduated with my undergrad, so I decided,"Well, I'll just go to grad school and get a couple more years out of it." Right. And, uh, for, for my internship for my Master's degree, I had to, you know, typically would've went to work in some government job, which I wasn't real excited about. So my department head said,"Pick anything you want. I'll let you go anywhere just to fulfill your internship." So I was like,"Well, I'd, I wanna, kinda wanna

9:22move to Nashville'cause I, I have a band and I just kinda wanna see it." So our family, uh, my dad and Chris LeDoux were, were great friends growing up, and I was friends with all the kids growing up, too, so I called Chris's boy, Will, who's a good buddy of mine, and said,"Hey, you know, does Chris's old manager do internships in Nashville?" Mm-hmm. And he said,"Yeah," which is TK Kimbrell, who m- also managed Chris and Sawyer Brown and, and Toby Keith. Mm-hmm. So I moved down here for a year and interned with TK and worked at Toby's record label at Show Dog. And then while I was down here, uh, I did my first record. I started writing a few songs and finding a few outside songs and recorded a record while I was down here, and then by the time I was done with my internship, I'd, I'd kinda made the decision. I was like,"Well, maybe I, I kinda wanna do music more than rodeo- Yeah ... just'cause I could do it a lot longer." Was there a moment where you were like,"This is where my paths are gonna divide"? Yeah,'cause I was, uh, I was not only riding saddle broncs and rodeoing and then I

10:24was playing music, but I was also being a picket man at rodeos, and picket men are the ones in the arena that, you know, get the, get the, the riders off the bucking horse and set them down safely. Yeah. So I was being a picket man, too, and so I was kinda doing all three and maybe not doing the best job I could do at all of them. Mm-hmm. My dad said, you know,"Why don't you just pick one and do it really good?" So I chose music, and that's kinda the path I decided just to put all my focus and attention onto music and stop rodeoing and stop picking up and, which led me down this path. But you still do a little bit- Yeah ... of the pick-up'cause recently there was the Nashville Rodeo. Yeah. Which is kinda cool, right? Because rodeos usually aren't in a major city like this. Th- they're, they're typically in most big cities. It's just Nashville hadn't had one for like- Oh ... 50 years or something. Okay. But, like, you know, they have PBRs, which is different. Uh, those are bull ridings. Oh, and they have them in Vegas and stuff. It's, yes. Yep, and then the National Finals Rodeo- Clearly I know a lot about rodeos. Can you tell? Yeah. Well, I'll teach you. Thank you. Yeah. I'm learning a lot right now.

11:25Yeah. It's very educational. Thank you very much. Um, but Nashville hadn't had a rodeo for a while, had it? Yeah, no. This is the second year they've had it s- in, like, 40 years, they said. But yeah, so I came down for the rodeo, and I'm friends with a lot of the contestants still and- Yeah ... the stock contractors. They're the ones that bring the bucking horses. So they're like,"Hey, get out there and help the guys pick up." So I went out and, you know, helped them pick up a little bit just for old time's sake. I've seen the videos. It was fun. Very... It's very, very cool. Um, I did watch a, an interview actually that you did with like some outlet that, that is about rodeos. Right. And it's almost like do you feel like you have two split personalities almost? That, like, when it's a, you know, publication maybe about rodeo and they want to talk to you about that side of things- Sure ... do you sort of put on a different hat than the music hat? Uh- Are you a schizophrenic? Yeah, a little bit. You know, like, I, you know, the path I chose in music, uh, there's no music scene in Wyoming, and so, uh, we grew up having to learn everything on our own, so-

12:25Yeah So I, I guess I've learned a lot about the music business, and songwriting, and touring as almost, like you said, maybe it is a second chapter in my life. Mm-hmm. But still, I know probably more about being a cowboy than I do about being a musician, but just'cause it's everything you grew up with. Yeah. I, I was a cowboy ever since I knew, you know, who I was. I was wearing a cowboy hat and boots and riding when I was four. Yeah. So that will never... That's, that's in me forever. So I can talk about rodeo and cowboy stuff for days and days, but I've had to learn the music business. It's pretty wild. It's, it's a little bit different than, than other aspects of life, including ranching or rodeo. Yeah. You know? Do you th- do you think there's lessons that you've learnt from, from the rodeo side of things that you can, that you can bring into the music industry? Yeah. I, I th- I think it all goes back to just, like, uh, hard work, you know? And I know everybody says that, but hard work for ranch kids is different than hard work for other people. Like, we grew up working, you know?

13:26Yeah. And so I've always just applied being a, a hardworking ranch kid cowboy to, to music. Just look at it like a job. Yeah. And work... The harder you work, the more successful you'll be. Which I've learned, you know, if you're the... If you work really hard at rodeo and you learn how to ride the best, you win all the time. Hmm. That's not really, the same applies in music. If, if you work really hard and you get really good, it sometimes doesn't mean you'll get, you'll make the most. You know? Yeah. Things happen in the music business that are, you know, handshake deals, somebody knows somebody. It's kinda more who you know sometimes versus how good you are. You know, I think the last five years of people getting record deals from being on TikTok and stuff. Yeah. Not saying they're not good, but that didn't come from hard work. Yeah. That come from getting lucky on the internet, you know? So I guess it's two different worlds to look at it. Like, if you work really hard at ranching, you will be successful- Yeah ... and you'll make your ranch bigger, make money. If you're really good at rodeo

14:27and you work really hard, you'll be the best. Mm-hmm. If you work really hard at music but things don't fall your way, sometimes it doesn't work. Mm-hmm. So we've had to, you know, navigate through the music business just doing it our way. Yeah. And if people like it, that's awesome, and if they don't, I don't really care, you know? There's certain people that like our stuff- Yeah ... and that's awesome. Those are guys who are our fans, but- Yeah ... you know, not all music is for everybody. Right. So yeah. It's interesting that you say that, actually,'cause we just had CMA Fest here in Nashville, and I was downtown with my husband and we were listening to some bands, you know, on stage and stuff, and he's like,"I don't understand why they're not, like, number one." You know, like, it is that thing where you're like, it... And Nashville is so talented. Yeah. There are so... You can throw a stone out the window right now and you could hit five- Right, for sure ... people who are, like, super talented. And you're like,"Why did that person- I know ... get to number one and not that person?" I know. It... That, that's what's confusing about it,'cause most occupations in life if, like I said, if you are the best and you work the hardest, you'll be the best. Yeah. You know? Music's not that way. And so I, I got several friends in town that are

15:30awesome, talented songwriters, players- Yeah ... singers, and like, why, why is nothing happening with them, you know? And then I see somebody, you know, that does a dance or something on the internet and it, it blows up, and next thing you know, they're out on tour at some festival- Yeah ... that never really played a live show before. You're like,"What?" But that's the way the, the world works. Yeah. You know? You just have to put blind... We just put blinders on and do it ourselves, do it our way, and what happens happens. Well, I mean, you're not doing too badly. Yeah. Well, it's been going good for us, too. You know, we love everything's... We keep... Every year, things keep getting bigger and bigger, and we like- Yeah ... that trajectory versus... You know, I guess if you'd asked me 10 years ago to be huge that day, I probably would've said yes, but I, I, I've kinda liked the slow and steady climb,'cause it's, it's built a career versus just, like, a number one and then they trade you in for the next guy that's number one, then you're kinda done. Yeah. So we've built the foundation, uh, of fans and a, and a real career that will have some longevity, that we can be playing live music when we're in our 70s, hopefully.

16:34Right You know? There must be some s- sense of fulfillment as well, that you know that you're putting in the hard work. You're doing what- For sure ... you enjoy. For sure. And, and we, we do get those moments, you know? Like, we just played the, the Grand Ole Opry at the Ryman a couple days ago, and you know, our hard work did get us that. Yeah. You know? We, we, we deserve to be there because we've worked hard- Yeah ... or they wouldn't ask you to be there. Mm-hmm. So, like, there are moments in, in the music business that, that we just stop and look at, and like,"Hey, we, we, we did this on our own." Yeah. "Like, nobody really helped us." Yeah. And, you know, getting to play things like Red Rocks, and we've done the Opry at Opry House six times, and Cheyenne Frontier Days five times. And so we, we've, we've gotten to do a lot of really cool things because of our hard work. Yeah. So it's not all good and bad, you know? I'm just saying, in general, sometimes- It's frustrating. Yeah. It... But, but you just gotta sort through and find the path and- Yeah ... and do it yourself. There was a couple of things. So basically you said everything that was now on my list to ask you about. Okay. But that's fine. Um, it's gonna be a very short, um, episode. No, I'm kidding. There

17:36were a couple of things that I wanted to talk about, which is... Now, forgive me for butchering this. Cheyenne? Cheyenne, yep. That's right. Okay. Yeah. That's how we say it in the UK. Um, the Cheyenne Frontier Days is a, is a huge... Explain the importance of that for people that don't sort of know. So Cheyenne Frontier Days started as a rodeo. Yeah. And it's, it's the biggest outdoor rodeo in the world, so as far as contestants go, it's huge. Mm-hmm. And it's 10 days in, in July, and it's been going on for, uh, 130 years. And I, I, I don't know the exact date. I should, but it's, it's one of the longest and biggest outdoor rodeos. So being from Wyoming, it's, it's a super special, uh, r- thing- Yeah ... that Wyoming has. And then, you know, throughout time, then they started having concerts afterwards too. Yeah. So it's not only now a giant rodeo, it's a big music festival, so they have big concerts every night. Mm-hmm. That rodeo means a lot to our family. My dad won Cheyenne in 1971. Um- That's cool ... we all rode there. I held the arena record there for a while in the rookie bronc

18:39riding. It's since been beat, but, uh, gotten to play there. Well, so you are... I have it written down here, you're only one of two artists that have competed in the rodeo and performed on the main stage. Yeah. Yeah, me and Chris LeDoux. And- Just you and Chris, basically. Yep. Yeah, so- That's pretty cool. It, it's a fun stat to have with Chris,'cause o- obviously Chris is the king of Wyoming, you know? Yeah. He kinda paved the way for all of us other rodeo cowboys that wanted to sing, or singers in general. Yeah. Like, they'll... Chris is and will always be the king of Wyoming, so having that stat with Chris is awesome. Right. And, uh... But yeah, you know, to rodeo at that level, where you're able to get into Cheyenne, it takes a lot of work to get- Yeah ... to that level of competitiveness to ride at Cheyenne, so... And then to get to the level of playing music where you're asked to play is also hard. Mm-hmm. So, and like we said earlier, there's not... there hasn't been a lot of cowboys that

19:39have done music, I guess both of that competitive level of both. Yeah. And Chris and I are both kinda unique in that way,'cause we rodeoed hard for a long time, then vended music. Yeah. So, and we're from Wyoming, so it's super special to have that stat with Chris. That's pretty cool. Yeah. And you opened for Brooks & Dunn there, right? Yep, well, for Brooks & Dunn there- That's not bad. Oh, it was so fun. And then the first time we ever got to open there was for Merle Haggard. I mean, that's pretty good, right? Yeah, I mean, it was... we were all- obviously he's one of the godfathers of country music. Yeah. And I- we got to play with him, like, one of the last years he was alive there at Cheyenne. That's incredible. Yeah. And you and the band, I... Did I read this correctly? When you did your Opry debut, you were, you... The Opry has the, the house band, right? Right. And they are, like, the best of the best. They're, like, the best players. Yeah, they're great. Like, it's... I've seen them rehearse, and they literally get given just a half a piece of paper with some- Yeah ... like, squiggles on it. They're so good, yeah. And all of a sudden they've got the song off pat like that. Right. But you got to take your own band to play with your Opry debut, right? Yeah. So the first, you know, first time they asked us to play the Opry, you know,

20:42typically we... I would've just went and sang with the Opry band. Yeah. Which I, I still would've. But we kindly asked, you know. I just felt like, you know, my band has put in the work with me all these years, that you only get one debut, right? Yeah. So I was like, asked them kindly if, if we could do this one, if I could do the debut with my band,'cause I felt like they earned the right to be there too. And so they, they agreed and we got to do it. We all got to debut together. Since then I've, I've played a few of the Opry shows with the Opry band, and they're great. Yeah. It's fun. But there's that one moment, like I said, you only get one debut, and I wanted to make it special for me and, and my group, so we all got to do it together. And are these the guys that you've been playing with for, for a long time? Yeah, Wyatt and Brook been with me a long time, but some of the other guys are newer, within the last six to eight years. But I think my newest member's been in four years, so everybody else has been in longer than that. So we've been together a long time. That's pretty cool. Yeah. And you're out on the road doing your thing. Yep. They all just flew out this morning, so I'm still here. And I'll meet back up with them in Wyoming, we got a show this weekend.

21:44That's cool. Yeah. That's very cool that you get to do that. It's cool that you got to share that at the Opry with them, okay. For sure. It, it was a moment that we'll all remember forever. Yeah. I love that. I do have written down here, uh, Toby Keith story. Yeah, so-... I got a few of those. I read one, and I know you've said this, you've probably said this before in a podcast, about when he called you up at, like... Was it when you had At Cheyenne. Um, you know, we've talked about, like, it being a 10-year town or whatever, or, like, you know, putting in the struggle and the hard work and stuff like that, but you have these moments of, like- Yeah ... throughout your career that are... that I think that anybody who's got, you know, a hit song or whatever, in quotes- Right ... from doing a TikTok dance- Right ... would hear these stories and go,"I want that career," right? Yeah, for sure. So tell us about Toby Keith and you getting a phone call in the middle of the night. Yeah. So leading up to that, so when I moved here, uh, to, to work at Show Dog and TKO is when I got to meet Toby officially. Yeah. And he al- he, he- What's that like?

22:44It was awesome. I, I was a little starstruck,'cause I mean, there's, there's sta- a ton of stars in town. There's a handful of superstars, right? Mm-hmm. You can name the superstars. Toby was one of those. And- I always say if you can say them by their first name- Yeah ... then people know who you're talking about. Reba, Toby, Tim- Dolly ... Garth. Exactly. You know. So Toby was one of those, and he just kinda took me under his wing when I lived here. You know, I, I was... I guess I, I knew how to be around famous people. Not that I'd been around a lot of famous people, but I'd been trained from my parents how to act around people. Mm-hmm. Just quiet and stay out of the way and work hard. And Toby, I think, noticed that, and kind of took a liking to me. So when I moved down here, the vehicle I drove was my old rodeo van. I had a'95 Chevy van. You know, those big conversion vans? Yeah. Toby loved that thing. And we were going to the BMI Awards one night. Toby was getting an award with, with Willie Nelson, and, uh, I was dropping TK off at the limo with Toby. They were gonna go to the red carpet. And Toby said,"Whose van is

23:47that?" And TK said, said,"Well, that's Chancey's." He said, you know,"Screw this limo, let's take that van." So they all piled into my old rodeo van, and we pull up to BMI's, and we're pulling up to the red carpet. You know, it's all limos and black cars. Yeah. And they, they must have thought I was lost,'cause they didn't know Toby was in there. I'm wearing my hat, and it's got Wyoming license plates. And they're trying to direct me out of traffic. But TK's like,"Stay right here." So we pull right up the red carpet, and, uh, Toby cracks the door open and he's like,"Hey, honk the horn." So Toby rolls out and I honked the horn, and the, you know, the, the paparazzi or whatever, they loved it. Yeah. It, it was neat. And then, so we always had that moment. And, uh, later on when I'd moved back to Wyoming after I'd stopped working for Toby to try my own music career, Toby was playing Cheyenne, and we had... were playing the beer tent. And so I'd got home, it was about 2:00 in the morning. Yeah. Was in my hotel room, and the phone rang, you know, and nobody calls the hotel phones anymore. And so I picked it up, and they're like,"Hey, we have Toby Keith

24:50down here." I was like,"What?" Like,"BS. Put him on." So, um, you know, it was 2:00 AM. I'm like,"Hello?" He's,"Hey, where you at?" I'm like,"Well, in my room." He's like,"Let's go cruise around. Is your van here?" So I'm like,"Sure." So I go down at 2:00 in the morning. Jason, his security guard, and Toby's entourage, we start... We cruise around Cheyenne in the middle of the night. Because why not? Why not? If Toby Keith says,"Let's go for a drive"- Exactly ... you're going for a drive, right? And I always thought...'Cause his booking agent is now my current b- booking agent, Kurt, and Kurt's like,"What if you'd never answered the phone that night?" Right? And so we have this story now that was, you know, such a great memory. So we drove around all for a couple hours, and we ran out of beer. And I was like,"Yeah, you can't buy beer in Wyoming after 2:00, Toby." And he's like,"I know where there's beer. Head to the airport." So we key into the tarmac and nose the van up to his jet, go on and drink on his jet till morning. And so we're, you know, just, you know, we're outside peeing on the tarmac and setting our drinks on the wings, and it was like a dream. And that night I was, you

25:51know, just kinda teasing Toby. I was like,"You know, if you need help singing Shoulda Been a Cowboy tomorrow, I've been practicing." Every night. And he's like,"Be there. Be there tomorrow." So this is, like, Cheyenne Frontier Days, which is my favorite rodeo and concert ever. Right. 20,000 people, with one of my heroes and his biggest song. And so, like, I, I tell people that all the time, how many superstars like that let their old intern come sing their biggest hit? Right. Like, that's how cool Toby was. He's like,"Be up there." And man, I was nervous, but so singing Shoulda Been a Cowboy with him at Sh- at Cheyenne Frontier Days. That is so awesome. Yeah. Just Toby was that great of a guy. I was gonna say, that speaks a lot for him because- Yeah ... and also in a way, it kind of... I love stories like that because it shows... It helps you become a better person- For sure ... because you've seen how people like that treat other people. For sure. You'll do the same. And Chris LeDoux was the same. Chris let us open for him when we were first starting. We weren't good at all. Yeah. And I, I, I remember Chris l- letting us do that in Billings in front of 8,000

26:52people and... So I do remember that in our career, like, if there's some young kid starting- Yeah ... to, like, help them out,'cause Toby did it, and Chris did it and... But Toby was the greatest. You know, about a month before he passed away, I was at the Opry, and Micah, his background singer, we're great friends. She sings at the Opry, too, and she's like,"Hey, let's send Toby a picture." And so we sent Toby a picture, and he texts back that... He's like,"That's my oldest son." Oh. And then he, you know, and then he passed away. So it was... Yeah, but we sure miss him, but he, he l- definitely left a mark on, on the world in music and everything. That's amazing. Yeah. It's incredible that you have those stories. I know. It's so wonderful. Sure miss him. It's so great. Yeah. Um, you are doing a lot already, and you have done a lot already. You know, like all of these- Right. ... these two very busy, slightly dangerous careers. Right. Right. We could say that about the music industry as well. But you've also s- decided to branch out into another very stable career of acting. Right. I mean, whatever I can make a nickel doing I'll do. But no, I, uh... Yeah, so

27:55did a couple films this last year and, and- How, how? How does that- Well- I, I mean, I ask really because I do a bit of acting as well, and I'd like to know, how did you get the jobs? Well, this... One thing I was in, it was for this, uh, docudrama they were, they were filming, and they wanted me to play a sheriff. It was the first sheriff t- that ever arrested Billy the Kid- Yeah ... before he was a full-on outlaw, a sheriff by the name of Harvey Whitehill. So they were filming it in Arizona at Mescal- Yeah ... where they filmed Tombstone, The Quick and the Dead, and Outlaw Josey Wales. All these great Westerns have been filmed there, so I told the guy that called. I was like,"You know, I've never done any acting." But so he's, he kinda told me what to do and just memorize my lines real good and just... He's like,"You're already a singer, a stage performer, you know, so you..." Yeah. But and they helped me, gave me tips through it, so got the- "Oh, you're fine. Just learn your lines and don't look directly down the camera." Yeah, exactly. So I, I came into that one s-... I, I was the lead the day we filmed 'cause I was the sheriff, so I, I had a whole bunch of lines. So I, you know, being

28:57a little nervous, I really wanted to do, do a good job and came prepared. Yeah. And so it was fun, and then I got to act across from a couple great actors, a guy named Golden Garnett, who's in, in a bunch of stuff, and Roberta Sparta. She's from Italy, and she's a great actor. She's been in some Star Wars stuff, but... So being across from them I think helped. But it w- it turned out really cool, and then my booking agent, Kurt, worked at UTA, got me the other film. It's coming out this summer. I won- They just told me this weekend it's gonna go to theaters, but it's a movie called Flint. It's off a old Louis L'Amour book- Yeah ... called Flint. They called and said,"Hey, we got you a part in this movie. You're a ranch hand for this, uh, guy named Tom Nugent. You're his..." And so I got two lines in it, so y- don't blink. You might miss it. Like, I'm in there pretty short, but- Hey, that's, you know- ... it's still fun to say is I'm in a Wes- a Louis L'Amour Western. But I, I didn't know if it was gonna go straight to Netflix or how it worked, but they... I seen Nick Barnes from UTA this week. He said it's going to theaters.

29:58That's so cool. Yeah. Do you get to go to the premiere? That's what I asked. Like- Do you still have the old truck? I got the van. Can you pull up in it- Yeah ... like you did with Toby? I'll bring the van down. Yeah. You have to do this. Yeah. You do know that- I know. ... if this goes, this happens, you're gonna have to do it. I'll drive it down. It still runs great, but yeah, they said they're gonna premiere it at, I think, a m- a movie festival they have in Nashville here. That's so cool. But yeah, it sounds exciting. So, and then I've read for a few other things. Yeah? Uh, you know, I, I think the, that world's pretty competitive, the acting world. And so is music, but- I think it's the same as music, if I'm honest ... I, I just told them I, like,"I'll read for anything. If looks like I fit something-" Yeah ..."let me know." One more part and you get, you get to be SAG eligible, I think. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. There you go. That's what they said. And then you get to give all your money to a union. That's right. Congratulations. And call yourself an actor. Um, this is so cool, though. I did read that the, um, the place where you shot the, uh, Billy the Kid thing, they had the world premiere there, and it was the first time they've ever done, like, a mini world premiere. Yeah. And that- That was just a short movie,'cause it was supposed to be along with a whole, um, bunch of other, like, parts of this docudrama-

31:00Yeah ... but the director liked that part so good, I think mostly'cause Golden played Billy the Kid so well- Yeah ... that he m- maybe wants to do more of a feature on that part of that. So he made our deal a standalone. So they did the premiere there. And then, uh, so we- Were you there for, for that? Yeah, so we went down to the premiere. And so in, in lieu of us, we went down and played a little acoustic set for it, and the folks at Mezcal said if I did that, they would let us use the studio to shoot a music video. So we shot a music video the next day that's... Wait, I could probably show you guys it. We just got the first cut back, but it's an old Western. It's like Buster Scruggs. Is it good? So, like, I'm riding down the street playing, but- You have to be ... it's for a song that we got coming out in September and an album called, uh, Thirsty & Blue. Yeah. So it's this kinda western, spaghetti western-type feel song that we shot at Mezcal, where they shot Tombstone. And, uh, yeah, so the album's coming out, called Thirsty & Blue. Uh-huh. And the song's Thirsty & Blue, and it's all coming out in September. But the whole

32:01thing kind of works together, right? I played in that movie. We got to shoot our m- music video there. And so yeah, it's been, it's kinda been a whirlwind this last year and stuff. You really are a real-life cowboy. Yeah. And then we just, I just got back from British Columbia. We, I w- hosted this TV show up there that's gonna be on Fox Sports, I think it actually airs in September too, called The Wild World of Western Sports. Yeah. And because I had rodeoed, and, uh, this is a TV show about not just rodeo but western sports, they're gonna have six or seven episodes. The first one was rodeo, so they wanted somebody on camera in between the cowboys and- Yeah ... kinda narrate the thing, so I did some hosting too, I guess. It's like I don't, I've never hosted, so like I said, I'll do whatever. I'll try everything. So out of rodeo, TV hosting, acting, and singing, if you have to pick one... I'm still sticking with singing. Yeah? I love performing live. And the acting thing's really fun-

33:01Yeah ...'cause it's, it's something completely d- new and different and, you know, it's... I guess you're still performing, just not in front of many people. Yeah. And you know, there might be 100 people on set or whatever, but... Also, if you mess up, you can just do it again. Exactly. Which is nice. I quite like that. Right. When you're singing in front of- Right ... thousands of people, if you mess up, ah. I, I think, I think that's why you see a lot of actors get into music, right? Right. 'Cause, like, Billy Bob Thornton and all these people that started playing music, 'cause they're such great actors, but they don't get that, that immediate response from a crowd, right? Yeah. So, like, they can go watch the movie later, and people love it, and they win awards, but the, when you're singing to a crowd and there's a, there's a connection with the crowd between your music or your songs and that crowd, you, you can't replicate that- Yeah ... on a movie necessarily. I mean, they get to do cool things, right? I bet most singers wanna be actors. Most actors- Right? ... wanna be singers. Most rodeo cowboys wanna be singers. Like, everybody wants to try what's different. But to me, that connection between a live audience and, like,

34:05trying to earn their trust and, like, let them hear your music, something that you've wrote from your heart that maybe changes somebody's life, translate live, there's nothing like that. Yeah. Yeah. You have that pull to write songs that, that affect people in a- For sure, I think ... in a good way or a bad way, but either way. Right. Yeah. I think all, I think all songwriters, that's the goal, right- Yeah ... is to maybe write something that changes one person's life somehow. Whether it's a drinking song or a love song or a sad song, that's why you write music, is for those moments. Or somebody might write you a message on Instagram, say,"Hey, man, this r- this song really changed me," or something. Yeah. That, like, that's why we do it. I love that. Yeah. Well, you are singing about the life you have lived, quite literally. Yeah. Which is funny. I, we always joke... So we do have a country music little bubbling industry in the UK, and s- when an e- a UK artist sings about the open road and riding the horses across- Right ... into the sunset, you're a bit like,"Hmm," um. Don't worry, Nashville also has that.

35:06You know. Yeah, exactly. But you literally are riding the horses into the sunset and- Yeah ... singing about it as well. I've been very fortunate to, to have lived that life to, to be able to sing about it. And, you know, I just try to be honest and authentic when I write and sing, 'cause I think fans are a lot smarter than some artists think they are. Yeah. It's, like, you can't fool them, you know? I see it a lot of times in town, you know, people trying to be somebody they're not, whether they're acting like a cowboy. I'm like,"That guy just started wearing a hat this year, and, like, five years ago was wearing, you know, skinny jeans." Like- Right ... who you trying to fool? Like- Yeah ... so I just try to stay in my lane, sing about stuff that I, that my fans can, can look at me on stage and be like,"Yeah, that guy's, that's real." Yeah. Like Chris LeDoux was, like Toby was, like George Strait is. Like, they're not trying to do anything to fool anybody. Yeah. So I just... And I wanna, you know, like, being a ranch rodeo cowboy is unique, and

36:06so I wanna write songs that, uh, you know, people in London or, or wherever can live vicariously through those songs. Yeah. Or somebody that lives in New York City or Los Angeles can maybe hear my music and be like,"Oh, man," and they can kinda live vicariously through- Yeah ... these songs and know that they're accurate. So you know, like, lyrically I write cowboy stuff that it has to be accurate, because my friends and my family and my colleagues- Mm-hmm ... are mostly are all cowboys. Yeah. So it has to be written right. You know, there's a lot of great cowboy songs in town that I get pitched sometimes, but where I'm a real cowboy and have lived it, I can't sing some of these that aren't perfect. Yeah. You know, that don't, don't quite line up,'cause, you know, and if- S- some other artist, you know, if Tim McGraw or somebody that, that didn't grow up being a cowboy, they can get away with singing those, and they're great songs. Yeah. But I just... Mine have to be what my buddies, what my brother won't call me like,

37:08"What'd you say in that song?" Like, that's not how we talk. They're gonna call you out- Yeah, like- ... if, if it's not authentic ... so it's gotta be how cowboys talk, the same lingo, the accurate, you know, all the accurate stuff about cowboy stuff. Well, it's working. Yeah. Well, thanks. It's definitely working. I think being authentic is the... Country music was always about- Right ... like three chords and the truth, right? So- Exactly ... I think if you, if you live by that, then you can't go wrong. I, I... They always ask me that, like,"What would you give a new artist advice on?" I said,"Man, don't, don't look what... Don't try to copy anybody else." Right. "Why would you do that? There's already that person." Yeah. Like,"That guy's already doing that." Like, I loved Chris LeDoux, but I never wanted to be Chris. Yeah. And I love Toby, but I, I, I can't do what Toby did and, like, go out and do all these patriotic songs. Yeah. I'm very patriotic, but, like, that was Toby's deal. Yeah. I can't... I don't wanna be copying anybody. I just try to do what I do and hopefully, like I said, people like it. Well- Yeah ... people are liking it for sure. I'm gonna make you rank your songs now. Okay. Basically. Oh, this'll be tough. This is a, a good segue. We're talking about music. This is horrible to do.

38:12Okay. I apologize, but I've got- This'll be fun ... your 10 songs somewhere here. Okay. And, um, we're doing the brackets, basically. Okay. Like sports teams. Yeah. I've been informed. I'm not a very sporty person. Hey, I- So ... I know brackets. Um, you know, I had to... Uh, somebody had to explain brackets to me. Yeah, that's all right. But I know more about sports now, and I know more about rodeo than I ever have done. So, um, I'm gonna basically say two songs. You pick one- Okay ... and then we'll move on to the next one and compare- You got it ... those two. Okay. Rodeo Cold Beer or The Saint? Why'd you have to put those two in the first ones? Sorry. Those, those are maybe my two favorite. Oh, I gotta go with Rodeo Cold Beer. It's... That one's been real good to me, but- Okay ... I hate to duck The Saint out. Sorry. Uh, Rodeo Cold Beer or The World Needs More Cowboys? See, those are my three favorite. Rodeo Cold Beer. Rodeo Cold Beer or A Cowboy Who Would? Rodeo Cold Beer. Rodeo Cold Beer or Highway Junkie? Rodeo Cold Beer. Rodeo Cold Beer or The Fastest Gun in Town?

39:13Hmm. Man, that's... You fired off with Rodeo Cold Beer. It's my favorite one, so I'll have to go with Rodeo Cold Beer again. But all those are, like, right there. Ugh. Rodeo Cold Beer or Wyoming Wind? Wyoming Wind is good, but I gotta go with Rodeo Cold Beer still. Okay. That song's been good to me. Uh, Rodeo Cold Beer or Meet Me in Montana? Rodeo Cold Beer. Rodeo Cold Beer or Feeling Something New? Still Rodeo Cold Beer. Okay. He's- I know ... he knows what he likes. Last one. Rodeo Cold Beer or It's My Life? Still Rodeo Cold Beer. If I had to go bracket them for you- Yeah ... the other way, you, you hit me with my, like, four favorites first. Sorry. Like, be like number one would be Rodeo Cold Beer, and then probably The Saint- Yeah ...'cause that's a fun, killing song. It's like an old West movie. Yeah. And then The World Needs More Cowboys, and then Fastest Gun. They're good songs. Well, thanks. They're really, they're all really good songs. I know I hate- Yeah, those ones that we write that have the stories are the ones I like.

40:15Yeah. And Rodeo Cold Beer was just... I'm so partial. That one's been so good to me. It's my, still my highest streaming song. Yeah. And I've put out, you know, I think I might have close to 100 songs I've put out. But that one is always just performs the... It's one of those, like, I look forward to singing every night still. Yeah. I like to sing them all, but that's just my, my baby. That one's special. Yeah. Fair enough. That is the top one. Um, we have top 10 country songs of all time. So if you have a look at this, these are our top 10 country songs of all time. We need you to remove one- Okay ... and replace it with another song. Well, it's definitely not Amarillo by Morning. That's the best song of all time, in my opinion, of country music. These are in no particular order- Okay ... by the way. So- If I had to... So I have to get rid of one of these? You have to get rid of one of them. Can I tell you a cool story about The Gambler? So- Always. Yeah ... so Don Schlitz wrote that. He just passed away this year. Yeah. And I got the opportunity to play the Opry with him a couple times. He's one of the greatest songwriters. He wrote, I think he wrote When You Say Nothing at All, too. That's so cool. And I went to Don's, uh, dressing room one night and was just kinda visiting with

41:18him. I was like,"Hey, man. Huge fan." Yeah. Uh, The Gambler, I was like,"Man, what, what a hit." He's like,"Was it?" I was like, "Yeah." He's like,"You know, that was, like, the sixth time it had been cut." Really? And he, and, you know, he's... Obviously, those great writers like that are real deep thinkers. He's like,"You know, I think it was, you know... Kenny Rogers had just come off of, uh, that big mo- uh, Western movie." Yeah. "And then the artwork for The Gambler was cool. It was, like, these guys playing poker, and Kenny Rogers." He's like,"I think all that aligned with the movie and then the song." But I was like,"I don't know. It's still a big old hit." It's a great song. Yeah. But it was fun getting to visit with Don. That's so- You know, and then he passed ... interesting that he is like,"Eh." Yeah. He's like,"Was it?" "Is it a good song?" I guess. He's like,"That was, like, the sixth time it got..." He was like,"Of course. It's, like, one of the biggest songs of all time." It's a great song. But, like, those guys are, like, cleverly humble, right? Yeah. They are. So like... Yeah. We sure miss him. That's cool. That's very cool. Well, let's see. I'm gonna- Well, that one's clearly staying on the list then. That one's staying. I mean, technically we've got two Johnny Cash songs on there now, I Walk the Line and Boy Named Sue,'cause that one-

42:18Right ... added. He Stopped Loving Her Today may be the saddest country song of all time. Yes. So that's staying. I feel like asking somebody like you, because your music is very kind of... It taps into the old school stuff a little bit. Right. This is quite hard. This is hard. Yeah. 'Cause I like all... It's... That's why I'm trying to, like, what would I pick? Don't worry. We won't tell them if you say- Okay ... they're off the list. Right. I'm not gonna call them up and be like,"Oi, Dolly.""Guess what Chancey said?" Right. I'm gonna have to X out, uh, Jolene. Ooh. Quick, someone get Dolly on the line. Not, not because I don't like the song, I just think I, I hear it too much. Yeah. You know, like- Yep. It's a bit overkill ... it, it's a great song for female singers, but they all do it. Yes. And like, I, I feel like I just hear it every time I hear a, a female sing and she sings it. Yeah. It's like if Folsom Prison was on here, I'd say the same thing. Every dude sings

43:19Folsom Prison. Yeah. I would take it off too, but that, that's hard. Fair enough. Who are you gonna put back, who are you gonna put on it, though? So you have to replace it- Okay ... with, with somebody. I wanna put Dan Seals, Everything That Glitters Isn't Gold. Okay. It's the sa- I would say it's the saddest rodeo song of all time. We're gonna make a note of that and we're gonna add it to the list for the next, um- Yeah ... unsuspected artist who's coming in. Have you ever heard it? I don't think I have, you know. I'll play it for you. It's, it's so sad. Okay. So like, him and his wife have a child, but she leaves the rodeo and leaves him with the kid, and he has to raise her. Yes. And then she doesn't even call for her birthday and oof. Tugs on the heartstrings. Yeah. Is this what you aspire to, to write a song like that? Yeah. And Bob McDill wrote that one. Bob McDill wrote tons of hits, like, uh, a bunch of Don Williams stuff. He wrote, uh, Don't Close Your Eyes. Mm-hmm. He wrote Good Ol' Boys Like Me, Don Williams, Louisiana Saturday Night. I mean, Bob McDill is one of the greatest writers of all time, too. Yeah. Still alive, but doesn't write anymore.

44:20Those are the best songs, right? Those are the best. What does... Last question for you. What does success look like to you? Is there a moment where you're like,"Oh, no, now I've made it," or- I know. I, I think it moves all the time. Yeah. I think if you would've asked me 10 years ago, like,"Hey, if you got to play the Opry seven times, and Cheyenne, and all these things-" Red Rocks ... like, would that be... Yeah. Yeah. I'd be like,"Oh, yeah." But every time, the bar moves. Uh-huh. You know, and so... But I'm not thinking... I, I don't know. I just don't know where that is. I'm always re- Like, every time we get to do something really neat- Yeah ... we're like,"Well, what's next? Let's do something bigger." Like, is it touring with George Strait, or is it touring with, you know, somebody big? Is it, is it playing overseas in London or wherever- Mm-hmm ... like doing the big, getting big in a different country? Is it, is it winning awards? I, I would say it's not necessarily winning awards. Like, I don't know if those things as much, hold as much value. I don't know.

45:20Yeah. I guess I don't wanna say that,'cause people that win'em deserve'em. But like, for me personally, I would rather just play to big, more people and bigger audiences, and get our music out there to more people- Yeah ... all the time and keep it growing. Yeah. Well, you are a real life cowboy. You've made a... The younger version of me is very happy- Well, thanks ... that you came in and had a chat with me today. I love your music because I'm ver- a big fan of old school country music, and your sound has that element to it, but with a, with an extra- Yeah. We, we try to be- ... something ... you know, we want our sound to be current. Yeah. You know, I'm definitely don't sound like old country, but we also wanna throw back. Like, our sound is a little bit'90s country, but with a newer edge on it, too. It tells the stories, though- Yeah ... and that's what I love about country music. I know. Those story songs are some of the greatest. They're the best. Yeah. Well, keep doing what you're doing. And Chancey, thank you so much for coming in and having a chat with us. Hey, thanks for having me on. Thanks for all you guys do for us. We appreciate that. You are more than welcome. Come back and see us again soon.

46:22I will.